Monday, March 2, 2009

Re: [BLUG] Re: BLUG Digest, Vol 13, Issue 1

My dad didn't get a choice. One day I drove over to Nashville and
replaced his antique PII W98 box with a newer PIII running PCLinuxOS. I
showed him the Internet button, the Email button, and the Write button.
Then I left.

He hasn't looked back. I get the occasional tech call, but it's always
of the 'how do I' nature, which means he's still havin' at it. I'm over
there every few weeks, and get it all updated and make sure everything
is working properly. Save for having to reinstall the printer one time
(don't ask me, it just quit working) and an AT&T modem that crapped out,
it's been solid for two years now.

He's 83. I hope he's cruisin' pr0n.

-
Mark Warner
SimplyMEPIS Linux v6.5
Registered Linux User #415318

Mark Krenz wrote:
> That's great! Can you talk to my dad. ;-) Ironically, he never
> trusts me when it comes to computers. Probably some of you have the
> same problem, but still have to do "tech support".
>
>
> On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 12:49:19AM GMT, Initech [initech@comcast.net] said the following:
>> freeman@freeman-desktop:~$ uptime
>> 19:46:16 up 1 day, 18:57, 2 users, load average: 0.22, 0.25, 0.18
>>
>> Not that impressive, unless you consider that until last month I was
>> running Windows. My family made the switch to Ubuntu and love it.


_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
BLUG@linuxfan.com
http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

Re: [BLUG] Re: BLUG Digest, Vol 13, Issue 1

That's great! Can you talk to my dad. ;-) Ironically, he never
trusts me when it comes to computers. Probably some of you have the
same problem, but still have to do "tech support".


On Tue, Mar 03, 2009 at 12:49:19AM GMT, Initech [initech@comcast.net] said the following:
> freeman@freeman-desktop:~$ uptime
> 19:46:16 up 1 day, 18:57, 2 users, load average: 0.22, 0.25, 0.18
>
> Not that impressive, unless you consider that until last month I was
> running Windows. My family made the switch to Ubuntu and love it.
>
>
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >[BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 03:21:41 +0000
> >To:
> >blug@cs.indiana.edu
> >
> >To:
> >blug@cs.indiana.edu
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> > 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
> >
> >Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> >amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> >the new network this week.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >David Ernst <david.ernst@davidernst.net>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 07:43:55 -0500
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >I've managed some machines in my day with extremely long
> >uptimes... not sure if I ever made 700 days, but in that range.
> >
> >I always had mixed feelings about it, though: don't you worry after a
> >while about all of the kernel updates that you haven't applied?
> >
> >David
> >
> >
> >On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
> >
> >>suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> >>02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
> >>
> >>Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> >>amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> >>the new network this week.
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>Mark Krenz
> >>Bloomington Linux Users Group
> >>http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>BLUG mailing list
> >>BLUG@linuxfan.com
> >>http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >Matt Standish <mstandish@gmail.com>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:28:19 -0500
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >I had an HP-UX machine reach ~800 days before. I had to reboot/reload
> >from tape after it was owned. After that I no longer cared about
> >uptime.
> >
> >
> >On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 10:21 PM, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
> >
> >>suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> >> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
> >>
> >>Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> >>amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> >>the new network this week.
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>Mark Krenz
> >>Bloomington Linux Users Group
> >>http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>BLUG mailing list
> >>BLUG@linuxfan.com
> >>http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:42:11 -0500
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> > 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
> >
> >This is a Solaris 7 running on end-of-lifed hardware. We fully expect
> >that if it ever goes down it just won't be coming back up. We're in the
> >process of migrating from it.
> >
> >Since that isn't running Linux, I felt obliged to mention the next one.
> >
> >(omitted):~$ uptime
> > 10:33:50 up 1058 days, 23:35, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
> >
> >This is a log vault. No ports open outside multiple firewalls. Only
> >two user accounts. The whole bit.
> >
> >Cheers,
> >Steven Black
> >
> >On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
> >
> >>suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> >> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
> >>
> >>Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> >>amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> >>the new network this week.
> >>
> >>
> >>--
> >>Mark Krenz
> >>Bloomington Linux Users Group
> >>http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> >>_______________________________________________
> >>BLUG mailing list
> >>BLUG@linuxfan.com
> >>http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:55:33 +0000
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu]
> >said the following:
> >
> >>blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> >> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
> >>
> >
> > Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
> >some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.
> >
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >Subject:
> >Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> >From:
> >Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu>
> >Date:
> >Mon, 2 Mar 2009 11:43:32 -0500
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >
> >To:
> >Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> >CC:
> >
> >
> >On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:55:33PM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
> >
> >>On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu]
> >>said the following:
> >>
> >>>blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> >>> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
> >>>
> >> Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
> >>some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.
> >>
> >
> >Yeah, I know in the grand scheme of things, I'm just a small fry.
> >
> >I always heard rumors that it was the BSD folks that managed the truly
> >huge uptimes.
> >
> >In Linux it is possible, but you need to be careful that you've compiled
> >your kernel to only use absolutely the features you need, and then you
> >need to monitor the kernel security issues. Then once the system has
> >been up a nice long while you have the added concern that if you do
> >encounter a security concern that effects you, the rest of the system is
> >then old enough that you need to either back-port security fixes to the
> >earlier kernel line, or you need to upgrade the whole OS.
> >
> >Personally, I wish my uptime was smaller than this. I'm in the process
> >of migrating all my systems to Ubuntu LTS. I really like the prospect of
> >knowing exactly when the next release will be available. The short-term
> >releases can be used as early betas for the next LTS release, so you can
> >be aware of upcoming major issues with internal software well before
> >the OS is actually released. (Sometimes when software is being phased
> >out, or certain libraries are being updated it can cause quite a bit of
> >concern if you are not prepared.)
> >
> >Cheers,
> >Steven Black
> >
> >
> >------------------------------------------------------------------------
> >
> >_______________________________________________
> >BLUG mailing list
> >BLUG@linuxfan.com
> >http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com
> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>

--
Mark Krenz
Bloomington Linux Users Group
http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
BLUG@linuxfan.com
http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

[BLUG] Re: BLUG Digest, Vol 13, Issue 1

freeman@freeman-desktop:~$ uptime
19:46:16 up 1 day, 18:57, 2 users, load average: 0.22, 0.25, 0.18

Not that impressive, unless you consider that until last month I was
running Windows. My family made the switch to Ubuntu and love it.


>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 03:21:41 +0000
> To:
> blug@cs.indiana.edu
>
> To:
> blug@cs.indiana.edu
> CC:
>
>
> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>
> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> the new network this week.
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> David Ernst <david.ernst@davidernst.net>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 07:43:55 -0500
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
>
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> CC:
>
>
> I've managed some machines in my day with extremely long
> uptimes... not sure if I ever made 700 days, but in that range.
>
> I always had mixed feelings about it, though: don't you worry after a
> while about all of the kernel updates that you haven't applied?
>
> David
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
>> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
>> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>>
>> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
>> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
>> the new network this week.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mark Krenz
>> Bloomington Linux Users Group
>> http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> BLUG mailing list
>> BLUG@linuxfan.com
>> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> Matt Standish <mstandish@gmail.com>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 09:28:19 -0500
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
>
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> CC:
>
>
> I had an HP-UX machine reach ~800 days before. I had to reboot/reload
> from tape after it was owned. After that I no longer cared about
> uptime.
>
>
> On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 10:21 PM, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
>
>> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
>> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>>
>> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
>> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
>> the new network this week.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mark Krenz
>> Bloomington Linux Users Group
>> http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> BLUG mailing list
>> BLUG@linuxfan.com
>> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 10:42:11 -0500
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
>
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> CC:
>
>
> blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
>
> This is a Solaris 7 running on end-of-lifed hardware. We fully expect
> that if it ever goes down it just won't be coming back up. We're in the
> process of migrating from it.
>
> Since that isn't running Linux, I felt obliged to mention the next one.
>
> (omitted):~$ uptime
> 10:33:50 up 1058 days, 23:35, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>
> This is a log vault. No ports open outside multiple firewalls. Only
> two user accounts. The whole bit.
>
> Cheers,
> Steven Black
>
> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
>> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
>> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>>
>> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
>> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
>> the new network this week.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Mark Krenz
>> Bloomington Linux Users Group
>> http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
>> _______________________________________________
>> BLUG mailing list
>> BLUG@linuxfan.com
>> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>>
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 15:55:33 +0000
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
>
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> CC:
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu] said the following:
>
>> blacks@bell:~$ uptime
>> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
>>
>
> Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
> some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.
>
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> Subject:
> Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars
> From:
> Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu>
> Date:
> Mon, 2 Mar 2009 11:43:32 -0500
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
>
> To:
> Bloomington LINUX Users Group <blug@cs.indiana.edu>
> CC:
>
>
> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:55:33PM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
>> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu] said the following:
>>
>>> blacks@bell:~$ uptime
>>> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
>>>
>> Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
>> some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.
>>
>
> Yeah, I know in the grand scheme of things, I'm just a small fry.
>
> I always heard rumors that it was the BSD folks that managed the truly
> huge uptimes.
>
> In Linux it is possible, but you need to be careful that you've compiled
> your kernel to only use absolutely the features you need, and then you
> need to monitor the kernel security issues. Then once the system has
> been up a nice long while you have the added concern that if you do
> encounter a security concern that effects you, the rest of the system is
> then old enough that you need to either back-port security fixes to the
> earlier kernel line, or you need to upgrade the whole OS.
>
> Personally, I wish my uptime was smaller than this. I'm in the process
> of migrating all my systems to Ubuntu LTS. I really like the prospect of
> knowing exactly when the next release will be available. The short-term
> releases can be used as early betas for the next LTS release, so you can
> be aware of upcoming major issues with internal software well before
> the OS is actually released. (Sometimes when software is being phased
> out, or certain libraries are being updated it can cause quite a bit of
> concern if you are not prepared.)
>
> Cheers,
> Steven Black
>
>
> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com
> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>
_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
BLUG@linuxfan.com
http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars

On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:55:33PM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
> On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu] said the following:
> > blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> > 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31
>
> Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
> some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.

Yeah, I know in the grand scheme of things, I'm just a small fry.

I always heard rumors that it was the BSD folks that managed the truly
huge uptimes.

In Linux it is possible, but you need to be careful that you've compiled
your kernel to only use absolutely the features you need, and then you
need to monitor the kernel security issues. Then once the system has
been up a nice long while you have the added concern that if you do
encounter a security concern that effects you, the rest of the system is
then old enough that you need to either back-port security fixes to the
earlier kernel line, or you need to upgrade the whole OS.

Personally, I wish my uptime was smaller than this. I'm in the process
of migrating all my systems to Ubuntu LTS. I really like the prospect of
knowing exactly when the next release will be available. The short-term
releases can be used as early betas for the next LTS release, so you can
be aware of upcoming major issues with internal software well before
the OS is actually released. (Sometimes when software is being phased
out, or certain libraries are being updated it can cause quite a bit of
concern if you are not prepared.)

Cheers,
Steven Black

Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars

On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:42:11PM GMT, Steven Black [blacks@indiana.edu] said the following:
> blacks@bell:~$ uptime
> 10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31

Wow, that's only a week away from 3 years. I guess you win. There are
some people online who report uptimes of 4-6 years though.

--
Mark Krenz
Bloomington Linux Users Group
http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
BLUG@linuxfan.com
http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars

blacks@bell:~$ uptime
10:33am up 1088 days 12:52, 7 users, load average: 0.22, 0.34, 0.31

This is a Solaris 7 running on end-of-lifed hardware. We fully expect
that if it ever goes down it just won't be coming back up. We're in the
process of migrating from it.

Since that isn't running Linux, I felt obliged to mention the next one.

(omitted):~$ uptime
10:33:50 up 1058 days, 23:35, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00

This is a log vault. No ports open outside multiple firewalls. Only
two user accounts. The whole bit.

Cheers,
Steven Black

On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>
> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> the new network this week.
>
>
> --
> Mark Krenz
> Bloomington Linux Users Group
> http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com
> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

--
Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu> / KeyID: 8596FA8E
Fingerprint: 108C 089C EFA4 832C BF07 78C2 DE71 5433 8596 FA8E

Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars

I had an HP-UX machine reach ~800 days before. I had to reboot/reload
from tape after it was owned. After that I no longer cared about
uptime.


On Sun, Mar 1, 2009 at 10:21 PM, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
>
> suso@hector ~ $ uptime
>  02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53,  1 user,  load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>
> Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
> amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
> the new network this week.
>
>
> --
> Mark Krenz
> Bloomington Linux Users Group
> http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com
> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>

--
Matt Standish
www.mattstandish.org

_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
BLUG@linuxfan.com
http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

Re: [BLUG] Uptime wars

I've managed some machines in my day with extremely long
uptimes... not sure if I ever made 700 days, but in that range.

I always had mixed feelings about it, though: don't you worry after a
while about all of the kernel updates that you haven't applied?

David


On Mon, Mar 02, 2009 at 03:21:41AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
>suso@hector ~ $ uptime
> 02:58:33 up 700 days, 22:53, 1 user, load average: 0.00, 0.00, 0.00
>
>Hector is the router on the old Suso network. So it does do a fair
>amount of work. Unfortunately, I'll have to turn it off to move it to
>the new network this week.
>
>
>--
>Mark Krenz
>Bloomington Linux Users Group
>http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
>_______________________________________________
>BLUG mailing list
>BLUG@linuxfan.com
>http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
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