Tuesday, August 21, 2007

Re: [BLUG] DVD player troubles

On Tue, 2007-08-21 at 02:16 -0400, Michel Salim wrote:
> Does the disc work fine on other computers, or under Windows?
Yes, I've tried a couple discs that *wouldn't* play under Linux on my
Windows partition, and both played fine. (Additionally, I tried one on
a friend's laptop and it worked fine there, too.) So VLC has no problem
talking to the drive under Windows, just under Linux.

> What version of libdvdread?
I was using 0.9.4 (from the repos), but I compiled the latest version
(0.9.7) to see if it would make a difference (it didn't).

> I used Lite-on the last time I made a purchase, and was quite happy
> with it.
I'll keep that in mind, thanks. I'd rather not spend $30 on a new one,
but I might have to. (I've taken to ripping ISO images to my hard drive
and mounting those. Maybe I'll stave off buying a new player until I
run out of hard drive space.)

> Firmware should be no problem for using VLC or mplayer,
> really, as long as you can get raw access to the disc (haven't heard
> any instance of it not working in Linux, unlike in Mac OS X where
> Apple controls the drivers)
The weird thing about this whole mess is that upgrading the firmware
*did* allow me to play some discs that I hadn't been able to play
previously, so it most likely had *some* impact.

> Make a BartPE Windows live CD?
Not a bad idea.

Cheers,
Evan

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Re: [BLUG] screen



On 8/21/07, Chris Shelton <cshelton@indiana.edu> wrote:
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

After a little bit of digging, I found this fairly good overview of
how to use screen including examples of what it is good for:

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2004/3/9/16838/14935


Thanks,  after I went through this, you can really save some time. At my last job, I'd come in and open up like 5 or 6 ssh connections at a time for different things. screen would have been really handy.

chris

On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 at 10:12pm, Matt Standish wrote:

> Something like this page would rock :)
>
> http://www.suso.org/docs/shell/ssh.sdf
>
>
> On 8/20/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
> >
> >   Would it be more helpful to have a presentation on it or just explain
> > it on list?
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 01:22:31AM GMT, Weldon Sams [ wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
> > > Mark, do you think you could explain again how screen is used? I played with
> > > it a little after that Gentoo presentation, but I'd really like to know how
> > > to use it.
> > >

- --
Chris Shelton
- -

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Re: [BLUG] screen



On 8/21/07, Weldon Sams <wsams@indiana.edu> wrote:
I know all that, I thought I confused someone with my writing. I'm a math major. I'm hip on bsd.

I was just pointing out a dunce moment I had.

On 8/21/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:33:40PM GMT, Weldon Sams [ wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
>
> ls -dH gives me ./ on Gentoo, but lists on Mac. I want to say that I didn't
> use -d on solaris and it still listed directories/symlinks as just the
> directory and not the contents.

  Hate to be an ass, but welcome to *nixland.  Options for many commands
are different on different unices.  Its partially a System V vs. BSD
thing, part just differences in general.  At least Linux is mostly
consistent among the distributions.

  Something I've noticed recently though is that the losetup command
for setting up loopback devices is very different between distributions.
On the systems I've tested, Fedora, RHEL, Ubuntu and Gentoo, each
distribution has slight differences, and the versions are different.
Its almost as if each distrubtion wrote its own version of losetup.


What is losetup?
 

--
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wsams@indiana.edu



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wsams@indiana.edu

Re: [BLUG] screen

I know all that, I thought I confused someone with my writing. I'm a math major. I'm hip on bsd.

I was just pointing out a dunce moment I had.

On 8/21/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:33:40PM GMT, Weldon Sams [ wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
>
> ls -dH gives me ./ on Gentoo, but lists on Mac. I want to say that I didn't
> use -d on solaris and it still listed directories/symlinks as just the
> directory and not the contents.

  Hate to be an ass, but welcome to *nixland.  Options for many commands
are different on different unices.  Its partially a System V vs. BSD
thing, part just differences in general.  At least Linux is mostly
consistent among the distributions.

  Something I've noticed recently though is that the losetup command
for setting up loopback devices is very different between distributions.
On the systems I've tested, Fedora, RHEL, Ubuntu and Gentoo, each
distribution has slight differences, and the versions are different.
Its almost as if each distrubtion wrote its own version of losetup.


--
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Bloomington Linux Users Group
http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
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wsams@indiana.edu

Re: [BLUG] screen

On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:33:40PM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
>
> ls -dH gives me ./ on Gentoo, but lists on Mac. I want to say that I didn't
> use -d on solaris and it still listed directories/symlinks as just the
> directory and not the contents.

Hate to be an ass, but welcome to *nixland. Options for many commands
are different on different unices. Its partially a System V vs. BSD
thing, part just differences in general. At least Linux is mostly
consistent among the distributions.

Something I've noticed recently though is that the losetup command
for setting up loopback devices is very different between distributions.
On the systems I've tested, Fedora, RHEL, Ubuntu and Gentoo, each
distribution has slight differences, and the versions are different.
Its almost as if each distrubtion wrote its own version of losetup.


--
Mark Krenz
Bloomington Linux Users Group
http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
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Re: [BLUG] screen

Sorry if this sounds choppy, I was having other conversations while writing this. Multi-Tasking at its finest. :)

Yep, I hate the colored ls output. I am using the -f option now instead of -d. What system are you using where -dH doesn't work? This doesn't work on my linux machines. I've only verified it on Mac.

I hope I didn't sound like I was saying 'ls -dH' is the end all of ls commands. I just meant, I always used 'ls -d' to avoid colored output, and then ran into the ls'ing symbolic links that didn't list the contents, but I didn't realize for 3 years the -d caused the problem. Basically, I accidentally ran into using -H to solve the problem, but didn't realize I could substitute -f for -dH. There are several other commands other than -d that require the -H command on Mac if you want to list directory contents while using -d ... etc. Between mac, linux and unix, they have different options for the same letter.

ls -dH gives me ./ on Gentoo, but lists on Mac. I want to say that I didn't use -d on solaris and it still listed directories/symlinks as just the directory and not the contents.

Weldon

On 8/21/07, Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu> wrote:
On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 02:20:29PM -0400, Weldon Sams wrote:
>    That sounds good -- screen and vi. Since you said vi, I think it could be
>    useful if we shared some of our favorite options and ways to use basic
>    unix commands (maybe even create a BLUG Cheat Sheet). Maybe just on the
>    list. I know I found out something useful on just good old "ls" this week
>    that drove me crazy for about 3 years. I always set the alias ls="ls -d"
>    because I hate a colored terminal and I want to see directories with the

You hate colored terminals? As in you hate the colored LS output like I do?
I just unset LS_COLORS, (or prevent it from being set), and make sure I don't
use aliases that include any color options.

>    trailing /. I didn't realize though that this henders ls'ing into symbolic

I'm a big fan of -f myself. It adds / to directories, * to executibles,
etc.

Using -d in an alias changes the effect of "ls somedir". Instead of
listing the contents of the directory you get the directory entry
itself.

In fact, I don't understand the benefits of aliasing ls to 'ls -dH'. As
an example:

blacks@somehost:~$ /bin/ls -dH
.

I used /bin/ls so as to avoid my alias. I don't get a directory listing
at all, and I don't get the / on directories, as you were saying you
were getting.

Cheers,
Steven Black

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Re: [BLUG] screen

On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 02:20:29PM -0400, Weldon Sams wrote:
> That sounds good -- screen and vi. Since you said vi, I think it could be
> useful if we shared some of our favorite options and ways to use basic
> unix commands (maybe even create a BLUG Cheat Sheet). Maybe just on the
> list. I know I found out something useful on just good old "ls" this week
> that drove me crazy for about 3 years. I always set the alias ls="ls -d"
> because I hate a colored terminal and I want to see directories with the

You hate colored terminals? As in you hate the colored LS output like I do?
I just unset LS_COLORS, (or prevent it from being set), and make sure I don't
use aliases that include any color options.

> trailing /. I didn't realize though that this henders ls'ing into symbolic

I'm a big fan of -f myself. It adds / to directories, * to executibles,
etc.

Using -d in an alias changes the effect of "ls somedir". Instead of
listing the contents of the directory you get the directory entry
itself.

In fact, I don't understand the benefits of aliasing ls to 'ls -dH'. As
an example:

blacks@somehost:~$ /bin/ls -dH
.

I used /bin/ls so as to avoid my alias. I don't get a directory listing
at all, and I don't get the / on directories, as you were saying you
were getting.

Cheers,
Steven Black

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Re: [BLUG] screen

Count me in as definitely interested in a meeting about screen and vi.


Weldon Sams wrote:
> That sounds good -- screen and vi. Since you said vi, I think it could
> be useful if we shared some of our favorite options and ways to use
> basic unix commands (maybe even create a BLUG Cheat Sheet). Maybe just
> on the list. I know I found out something useful on just good old "ls"
> this week that drove me crazy for about 3 years. I always set the alias
> ls="ls -d" because I hate a colored terminal and I want to see
> directories with the trailing /. I didn't realize though that this
> henders ls'ing into symbolic links. If you add ls -dH then you can list
> the contents of symbolic links. I ran into this problem on Solaris 10
> and Mac OS X. "-H" works on Mac OS X. I'm not sure if the options are
> the same in unix -- they definitely aren't on my Gentoo machine.
>
> Weldon
>
> On 8/21/07, *Mark Krenz* <mark@slugbug.org <mailto:mark@slugbug.org>> wrote:
>
>
> Alright. I can give the a presentation at the next meeting or if that
> it taken then the one after that. screen might only take about 30
> minutes to go over so I can also show the power of vim (vi) in
> another 30-45
> minutes.
>
> On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 06:53:57AM GMT, Weldon Sams
> [wsams@indiana.edu <mailto:wsams@indiana.edu>] said the following:
> > A presentation might be nice, that way we could see some scenarios in
> > action.
> >
> > On 8/20/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org
> <mailto:mark@slugbug.org>> wrote:
> > >
> > >
> > > Would it be more helpful to have a presentation on it or just
> explain
> > > it on list?
> > >
> > > On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 01:22:31AM GMT, Weldon Sams
> [wsams@indiana.edu <mailto:wsams@indiana.edu>]
> > > said the following:
> > > > Mark, do you think you could explain again how screen is used?
> I played
> > > with
> > > > it a little after that Gentoo presentation, but I'd really
> like to know
> > > how
> > > > to use it.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks, Weldon
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Weldon Sams
> > > > wsams@indiana.edu <mailto:wsams@indiana.edu>
> > >
> > > --
> > > Mark Krenz
> > > Bloomington Linux Users Group
> > > http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > BLUG mailing list
> > > BLUG@linuxfan.com <mailto:BLUG@linuxfan.com>
> > > http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> > --
> > Weldon Sams
> > wsams@indiana.edu <mailto:wsams@indiana.edu>
>
> --
> Mark Krenz
> Bloomington Linux Users Group
>

http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com <mailto:BLUG@linuxfan.com>
>

http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>
>
>
>
> --
> Weldon Sams
> wsams@indiana.edu <mailto:wsams@indiana.edu>


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Re: [BLUG] screen

That sounds good -- screen and vi. Since you said vi, I think it could be useful if we shared some of our favorite options and ways to use basic unix commands (maybe even create a BLUG Cheat Sheet). Maybe just on the list. I know I found out something useful on just good old "ls" this week that drove me crazy for about 3 years. I always set the alias ls="ls -d" because I hate a colored terminal and I want to see directories with the trailing /. I didn't realize though that this henders ls'ing into symbolic links. If you add ls -dH then you can list the contents of symbolic links. I ran into this problem on Solaris 10 and Mac OS X. "-H" works on Mac OS X. I'm not sure if the options are the same in unix -- they definitely aren't on my Gentoo machine.

Weldon

On 8/21/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:

  Alright.  I can give the a presentation at the next meeting or if that
it taken then the one after that.  screen might only take about 30
minutes to go over so I can also show the power of vim (vi) in another 30-45
minutes.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 06:53:57AM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
> A presentation might be nice, that way we could see some scenarios in
> action.
>
> On 8/20/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> >   Would it be more helpful to have a presentation on it or just explain
> > it on list?
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 01:22:31AM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu]
> > said the following:
> > > Mark, do you think you could explain again how screen is used? I played
> > with
> > > it a little after that Gentoo presentation, but I'd really like to know
> > how
> > > to use it.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Weldon
> > >
> > > --
> > > Weldon Sams
> > > wsams@indiana.edu
> >
> > --
> > Mark Krenz
> > Bloomington Linux Users Group
> > http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> > _______________________________________________
> > BLUG mailing list
> > BLUG@linuxfan.com
> > http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Weldon Sams
> wsams@indiana.edu

--
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http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
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--
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wsams@indiana.edu

Re: [BLUG] Social Meeting

Right now I am thinking of having this month's Social Meeting at Opies,
next month's at Upland, and then October's meeting at Tutto Bene. Does
that sound okay to everyone?

BTW: I am craving Shelia Ann's Chili Cheese fries from Opies, so that
influenced me. An Opie dog with ketchup, mustard and sweet relish
sounds good too.

BTW: Opies does carry Upland beer.

Thank you,
Scott Blaydes


Mark Krenz wrote:
> We could try Tutto Bene.
>
>

http://kelley.iu.edu/mba/kelleyLife/
>
> Tutto Bene is meant for meetings like this and they have beer as well
> as wine, appetizers, etc. I think it would make a good venue.
>
> On Mon, Aug 20, 2007 at 06:23:10PM GMT, Scott Blaydes [sblaydes@sbce.org] said the following:
>> It was proposed by someone who used to live in the Bloomington area that
>> we start having some social meetings at a local resturant/pub. Does
>> that sound good to anyone else? I was figuring we could get together
>> about 7:30 this Thursday for a social meeting if others like the idea.
>> So far I have been thinking of possibly giving Upland Brewing Company
>> (http://www.uplandbeer.com) or Opie Taylors
>> (http://www.bloomingpedia.org/wiki/Opie_Taylors) a try for the venue,
>> but I am open to other suggestions. According to the Upland website, it
>> is family dining, so age of attendees is a non-issue. Both places have
>> good food and good beer, so that requirement is fulfilled.
>>
>> So, 7:30pm on Aug 23rd at ?Upland? or ?Opies?. How does this sound to
>> everyone?
>>
>> Thank you,
>> Scott Blaydes
>> _______________________________________________
>> BLUG mailing list
>> BLUG@linuxfan.com
>> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>>
>

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Re: [BLUG] screen

Thats a great summary. I use it for work IRC (stay logged in forever)
and long compiles or updates (I can go home then reconnect to screen
and see where I am at).

On 8/21/07, Steven Black <blacks@indiana.edu> wrote:
> I look forward to the presentation. Personally, I'm an avid Screen user.
>
> Here's a few of my personal thoughts on the matter.
>
> Benefits of using screen:
> * It allows me to pause what I'm doing and come in to work and pick up
> where I left off.
> * It allows you to have multiple connections over the same secure link --
> I can SSH through multiple machines to get to my destination, then run
> Screen there and have immediate access to more sessions.
> * It allows you to do multiple things when connected via a serial (direct
> or modem (think BBS, not PPP)) connection. -- In a server environment
> you may be using a serial console.
> * Provides a uniform way for me to have one big terminal window instead of
> lots of small terminal windows. (Tabs don't work the same in different
> applications that support them.) -- I do this on my laptop, when it is
> on my lap and I expect to be leaning back on my recliner/couch/whatever.
> * Provides a uniform way for me to monitor an application for change.
> (Some, but very few, GUI terminal applications support this.) I use this
> when I work from home (on my laptop) to monitor the work-related IRC
> channel for chatter. (At work, I just use two large monitors.)
> * Provides a uniform way to switch to specific screens using key-bindings.
> While this is supported in most tab-based GUI terminal emulators, the
> key bindings vary.
>
> Old school benefits of using screen:
> * Reduced traffic from server to client as opposed to multiple direct
> connections (useful with PPP/SLIP over a standard modem)
> * Text-mode web-browsing with Screen and multiple text-based web-browsers
> (such as Lynx, w3m, Links, etc.) is zippy even over slow connections.
> Research and even downloads would regularly go fast enough that I kept
> busy.
> * Screen allows dedicated dumb terminals to virtually support multiple
> connections to the same host. (While most people think "dumb terminal"
> is only equal to vt100's and the like, it also applies to Apple ]['s
> connected to an external modem logged in to a shell account.)
>
> Arguments against using screen:
> * Scroll-back doesn't work as expected.
> * Control-A is over-loaded. This effects EMACS key-bindings. (This can be
> seen in every GNU Read-line-based application, such as BASH.) GNU Readline
> supports VI-like keybindings using "set editing-mode vi" in your .inputrc,
> and GNU Screen supports changing the escape key with the -e command-line
> argument or the "escape" command in your .screenrc.
> * If you use EMACS, you can consider it superfluous. You may do better to
> learn the EMACS method, rather than using Screen.
> * If you only ever use your own accounts on your own machines, you may have
> things configured so that you don't need Screen.
>
> Cheers,
> Steven Black
>
> On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:21:01AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
> >
> > Alright. I can give the a presentation at the next meeting or if that
> > it taken then the one after that. screen might only take about 30
> > minutes to go over so I can also show the power of vim (vi) in another 30-45
> > minutes.
> _______________________________________________
> BLUG mailing list
> BLUG@linuxfan.com
> http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
>


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Re: [BLUG] screen

I look forward to the presentation. Personally, I'm an avid Screen user.

Here's a few of my personal thoughts on the matter.

Benefits of using screen:
* It allows me to pause what I'm doing and come in to work and pick up
where I left off.
* It allows you to have multiple connections over the same secure link --
I can SSH through multiple machines to get to my destination, then run
Screen there and have immediate access to more sessions.
* It allows you to do multiple things when connected via a serial (direct
or modem (think BBS, not PPP)) connection. -- In a server environment
you may be using a serial console.
* Provides a uniform way for me to have one big terminal window instead of
lots of small terminal windows. (Tabs don't work the same in different
applications that support them.) -- I do this on my laptop, when it is
on my lap and I expect to be leaning back on my recliner/couch/whatever.
* Provides a uniform way for me to monitor an application for change.
(Some, but very few, GUI terminal applications support this.) I use this
when I work from home (on my laptop) to monitor the work-related IRC
channel for chatter. (At work, I just use two large monitors.)
* Provides a uniform way to switch to specific screens using key-bindings.
While this is supported in most tab-based GUI terminal emulators, the
key bindings vary.

Old school benefits of using screen:
* Reduced traffic from server to client as opposed to multiple direct
connections (useful with PPP/SLIP over a standard modem)
* Text-mode web-browsing with Screen and multiple text-based web-browsers
(such as Lynx, w3m, Links, etc.) is zippy even over slow connections.
Research and even downloads would regularly go fast enough that I kept
busy.
* Screen allows dedicated dumb terminals to virtually support multiple
connections to the same host. (While most people think "dumb terminal"
is only equal to vt100's and the like, it also applies to Apple ]['s
connected to an external modem logged in to a shell account.)

Arguments against using screen:
* Scroll-back doesn't work as expected.
* Control-A is over-loaded. This effects EMACS key-bindings. (This can be
seen in every GNU Read-line-based application, such as BASH.) GNU Readline
supports VI-like keybindings using "set editing-mode vi" in your .inputrc,
and GNU Screen supports changing the escape key with the -e command-line
argument or the "escape" command in your .screenrc.
* If you use EMACS, you can consider it superfluous. You may do better to
learn the EMACS method, rather than using Screen.
* If you only ever use your own accounts on your own machines, you may have
things configured so that you don't need Screen.

Cheers,
Steven Black

On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 11:21:01AM +0000, Mark Krenz wrote:
>
> Alright. I can give the a presentation at the next meeting or if that
> it taken then the one after that. screen might only take about 30
> minutes to go over so I can also show the power of vim (vi) in another 30-45
> minutes.
_______________________________________________
BLUG mailing list
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http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug

Re: [BLUG] screen

-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
Hash: SHA1

After a little bit of digging, I found this fairly good overview of
how to use screen including examples of what it is good for:

http://www.kuro5hin.org/story/2004/3/9/16838/14935

chris

On Mon, 20 Aug 2007 at 10:12pm, Matt Standish wrote:

> Something like this page would rock :)
>
> http://www.suso.org/docs/shell/ssh.sdf
>
>
> On 8/20/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
> >
> > Would it be more helpful to have a presentation on it or just explain
> > it on list?
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 01:22:31AM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
> > > Mark, do you think you could explain again how screen is used? I played with
> > > it a little after that Gentoo presentation, but I'd really like to know how
> > > to use it.
> > >

- --
Chris Shelton
- -

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Re: [BLUG] screen

Alright. I can give the a presentation at the next meeting or if that
it taken then the one after that. screen might only take about 30
minutes to go over so I can also show the power of vim (vi) in another 30-45
minutes.

On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 06:53:57AM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu] said the following:
> A presentation might be nice, that way we could see some scenarios in
> action.
>
> On 8/20/07, Mark Krenz <mark@slugbug.org> wrote:
> >
> >
> > Would it be more helpful to have a presentation on it or just explain
> > it on list?
> >
> > On Tue, Aug 21, 2007 at 01:22:31AM GMT, Weldon Sams [wsams@indiana.edu]
> > said the following:
> > > Mark, do you think you could explain again how screen is used? I played
> > with
> > > it a little after that Gentoo presentation, but I'd really like to know
> > how
> > > to use it.
> > >
> > > Thanks, Weldon
> > >
> > > --
> > > Weldon Sams
> > > wsams@indiana.edu
> >
> > --
> > Mark Krenz
> > Bloomington Linux Users Group
> > http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
> > _______________________________________________
> > BLUG mailing list
> > BLUG@linuxfan.com
> > http://mailman.cs.indiana.edu/mailman/listinfo/blug
> >
>
>
>
> --
> Weldon Sams
> wsams@indiana.edu

--
Mark Krenz
Bloomington Linux Users Group
http://www.bloomingtonlinux.org/
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